Lining up

[landmeister]

Dear all,

This situation raised in my last game and your opinions would be appreciated. All elements are Cv. Element A is mine. I want to contact element 1 but 2 is obstructing it.

First question. Can I choose that element 1 lines up against A? I would say no as per page 33. Otherwise, element 2 should be moved backwards, but this is not allowed as per page 33 (but it seems so at Figure 11). We finally moved it backwards  .

Second question. What would happen if 2 was TZed? The rules are initially silent and I find no answer in the Commentary. Could this be a situation in which my contact would not be possible?

Thank you.

[Barritus]

Dear all,

This situation raised in my last game and your opinions would be appreciated. All elements are Cv. Element A is mine. I want to contact element 1 but 2 is obstructing it.

First question. Can I choose that element 1 lines up against A? I would say no as per page 33.

That seems right to me.

Otherwise, element 2 should be moved backwards, but this is not allowed as per page 33...

Which words on page 33 say it is not allowed?

...(but it seems so at Figure 11). We finally moved it backwards  .

Well, as I see it, Figure 11 agrees with the first paragraph of page 33 - the blocking enemy element is moved back.

[Second question. What would happen if 2 was TZed? The rules are initially silent and I find no answer in the Commentary. Could this be a situation in which my contact would not be possible?

I think the TZ would make no difference. My interpretation is that if the rules draw no distinction between a TZ being present or absent, that fact makes no difference.

[andrew]

I agree element 2 should be moved backwards, but only by the minimum necessary.  This would then result in that element contacting your flank and element #2 could then use up to 80 paces of free movement to slide into a legal front edge to side edge contact.  You would then take a -1 in the combat and die if you lose.  So I'm not sure why you would want to initiate combat, without first clearing away element 2.......?

Cheers
Andrew

[landmeister]

Which words on page 33 say it is not allowed?

First para. An enemy element can pivot, slide sideways or move behind a friend. Moving backwards is not specified.

Well, as I see it, Figure 11 agrees with the first paragraph of page 33 - the blocking enemy element is moved back.

I'm afraid it doesn't. As I said backwards movements are not included in the first para of page 33. This contradiction between page 33 and Figure 11 has already been identified in the Commentary.

I think the TZ would make no difference. My interpretation is that if the rules draw no distinction between a TZ being present or absent, that fact makes no difference.

I'm talking about a new TZ from another fiendly element not included in my diagram (for example TZing the flank of 2). According to the Commentary, that TZ has to be respected.

[landmeister]

I agree element 2 should be moved backwards, but only by the minimum necessary.  This would then result in that element contacting your flank and element #2 could then use up to 80 paces of free movement to slide into a legal front edge to side edge contact.  You would then take a -1 in the combat and die if you lose.  So I'm not sure why you would want to initiate combat, without first clearing away element 2.......?

Because it was a damned spontaneous move!  I had no choice 

[andrew]

I see!

Nice catch with backwards part.  The sentence at the top of p33 about "moving it behind another" probably needs to be clarified.  I can see that being open to all sorts of weird interpretations by a suitably determined player......

Cheers
Andrew