Flee moves for double based troops.

[william]

  Unusual I know.

If an element's flee move is measured from it's initial rear before recoil, on a DBE element is that the inital rear of the rear element or the nominial position of the back end of the front part of the DBE ?

EG If a japanese Cv(O) element is DBEd with an Ax element and the Cv(O) flees, How far does it flee and which initial 'rear' is it measured from, the rear of the Cv(O) or the Ax ?

in another eg a Byzantine double based Kn(X)/Kn(I) flees which 'rear' does one measure from, the Kn(X) or the Kn(I) ?

William

[Richa_Eire]

Its all on the page describing the way double based elements work.... The notional rear of the front element is the one used for flee moves etc.... The other interesting thing to note is that compulsory double based elements per the lists are both killed where appropriate, voluntarily double based elements "make change" if one is destroyed. Also double based cavalry and lights do not pay per element for moves to the rear etc.

[LawrenceG]

Its all on the page describing the way double based elements work.... The notional rear of the front element is the one used for flee moves etc.... The other interesting thing to note is that compulsory double based elements per the lists are both killed where appropriate, voluntarily double based elements "make change" if one is destroyed. Also double based cavalry and lights do not pay per element for moves to the rear etc.

Actually, no. If you read page 13 you will see that the rear of the front element is only used for recoils, pursuits, and the zone of death when destroyed.

Otherwise it moves as if a single element, which means the entire base is treated as a single element, i.e. the front of the front is the front, the rear of the rear is the rear and the combined flanks of front and rear form the whole flank.

The line "It makes outcome moves as if a single element of the front type" is a bit confusing, but the context implies that this is a statement about what outcome move to make, not about how far to move or where to measure from, which the other bullet points cover.

The basic principle is that a compulsory double base is a single element, except for slight differences to make recoils etc consistent with single base elements and account for the fact it may contain different troop types.

[Richa_Eire]

Its all on the page describing the way double based elements work.... The notional rear of the front element is the one used for flee moves etc.... The other interesting thing to note is that compulsory double based elements per the lists are both killed where appropriate, voluntarily double based elements "make change" if one is destroyed. Also double based cavalry and lights do not pay per element for moves to the rear etc.

Actually, no. If you read page 13 you will see that the rear of the front element is only used for recoils, pursuits, and the zone of death when destroyed.

Otherwise it moves as if a single element, which means the entire base is treated as a single element, i.e. the front of the front is the front, the rear of the rear is the rear and the combined flanks of front and rear form the whole flank.

The line "It makes outcome moves as if a single element of the front type" is a bit confusing, but the context implies that this is a statement about what outcome move to make, not about how far to move or where to measure from, which the other bullet points cover.

The basic principle is that a compulsory double base is a single element, except for slight differences to make recoils etc consistent with single base elements and account for the fact it may contain different troop types.

Thanks Lawrence, on re-reading your right...... which is a good thing (for me).

[william]

  Great lads I am so glad you understand this topic  , if either of you could tell me the flee moves of the two examples I gave then I might be able to follow it myself ( I am but a simple soul and a picture { or concrete example } is worth a thousand words ).

I could of course discuss face to face with Richard on Monday or Lawrence on Friday, where is Mike when I need him to put my poor mind at rest.

Of course leading on from this if one voluntarily DBEs, say Lh(F) does it now mean that they can repulse ? I think your both saying that if one had double based Cv that fled against Camalry that the camel element could not move into the rear of the fled element in one move ?

Still a small bit confused ( sorry )

William

[LawrenceG]

Double LH(F): Repulse is an outcome move, hence it is a move and they move as if a single element. Therefore the front half is not pushing back the rear half. Therefore it can do a complete repulse.

DOuble Cv: place your measuring stick against the rear of the double base before the recoil. Move the double base so its rear is against the other end of the measuring stick and it is facing the opposite direction. (Apply the same principle if the element has to deviate to avoid obstructions - basically treat it as a single element of twice the normal depth). Camels won't be able to catch you, even if they pursued (unless they use march moves).

[william]

  Thanks Lawrence

William