Author Topic: Terrain selection  (Read 3106 times)

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Concretedust

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Terrain selection
« on: October 24, 2015, 10:16:40 AM »
Hi all,

I was wondering, what is the general consensus regarding size of terrain and type?
I use Mithridatic with AG 3. My army is as follows.

1   Irr Kn (I) Sub
4   Irr Ax (S)
4   Irr Ax (O)
8   Irr Ps (O)
8   Irr LH (O)

   
   
1   Reg Cv (O) C-in-C
8   Reg Pk (O)
16   Reg Pk (I)

   
   
1   Irr Kn (I) Sub
4   Reg Ax (S)
6   Irr Wb (O)
2   Irr Bd (F)
4   Irr Ps (O)
4   Irr LH (F)
3   Irr Kn (I)
2   Reg Exp (O)

   
   
1   Irr Kn (X) Armenian Ally-General
3   Irr Kn (X)
2   Irr LH (F)

   
   
6   Irr Bg (I)


I like to really shake things up tactically when I play games by utilizing terrain to the best advantage, the only thing is I am not very good at it and want to become better!

I though of using my 0-2 FE when attacking as DG in an attempt to better control/predict my opponents game plan. It also allows me to get the best out of my light troops and minimizes where the battle is fought between the heavier troops. DG gets placed relativity early before most other pieces so i feel is a good choice. Would this be a good assumption?, most of the players I play against seem to think otherwise but I am not sure if this so they can manipulate terrain to their advantage or if it is read good advice. Can anyone offer advice on this?

On Defense I usually use 1/2 ME equivalents of DG to break things up, again not sure if this is a good idea or not, I know it very much depends on who you are fighting but I feel that terrain should be best used to get the best out of my army, unless the opponent has a better army for this type of terrain.

Please help I feel I may be loosing games before I even start.

Concretedust.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2015, 07:54:53 PM by Concretedust »

Duncan Head

  • Guest
Re: Terrain selection
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2015, 03:14:30 PM »
You've still, despite our earlier discussion, got more baggage in there than you are allowed. I thought I explained clearly that you can only have 0-2 elements of Bge per command in total, but you list 13 Bge for four commands!

Concretedust

  • Guest
Re: Terrain selection
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2015, 07:54:31 PM »
Duncan,

Yes I did remember i just wrote it down wrong. The Bge in each command is not there the fifth command is the only of Bge.

Thanks for pointing it out again..

LawrenceG1

  • Guest
Re: Terrain selection
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2015, 06:19:17 PM »
Well, you only have 2 commands that can fight in rough or difficult terrain and your main punch is the Pikes and KnX that can only fight in the open, but you may want to outflank the enemy with the 8 LH in command 1, so whatever terrain you choose, you probably should try to place it away from the table edge. Ax need a lot of PIPs to advance through defended difficult going, so you may be better off taking at least some rough instead of difficult.

As invader you will find the defender's terrain picks dominate the terrain, so you should try to anticipate what he will pick. If you think he will pick a lot of difficult terrain, best not pick any yourself. You will probably deploy second, so you will be able to see where the enemy is and won't need to force him into a particular area by using your own terrain.

The Wb/Bd and Irr KnX don't manoeuvre very well so if defending you may wish to take size 2 difficult goings and try to get them in the enemy half of the table so you know where he is going to be.

Your army has a complex mix of troops, so it may take quite a few games to get a good feel for what terrain works well for it.

Concretedust

  • Guest
Re: Terrain selection
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2015, 08:05:15 AM »
LawrenceG1,




The Wb/Bd and Irr KnX don't manoeuvre very well so if defending you may wish to take size 2 difficult goings and try to get them in the enemy half of the table so you know where he is going to be.



The idea I was thinking on was just that,  trying to force my opponent into deploying his troops where I want them, heavy troops/cavalry in the open areas vs my command 2 and 3. The command 1 would occupy the DG and delay/harass/control it by denying the enemy space. This would allow me to use my main force to safely fight the enemy I want in the location I want.

Rough going may be a better option in hindsight, I think I will try that also.

Many thanks again, I will try some things out and provide some feedback soon.

Concretedust.

Barritus

  • Guest
Re: Terrain selection
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2015, 02:01:19 PM »
LawrenceG1,




The Wb/Bd and Irr KnX don't manoeuvre very well so if defending you may wish to take size 2 difficult goings and try to get them in the enemy half of the table so you know where he is going to be.



The idea I was thinking on was just that,  trying to force my opponent into deploying his troops where I want them, heavy troops/cavalry in the open areas vs my command 2 and 3. The command 1 would occupy the DG and delay/harass/control it by denying the enemy space. This would allow me to use my main force to safely fight the enemy I want in the location I want.

Rough going may be a better option in hindsight, I think I will try that also.

Many thanks again, I will try some things out and provide some feedback soon.

Concretedust.

G'day Concretedust

I like your idea of trying as much as possible to exploit the terrain. Back in the days of DBM I had a lot of fun with Hellenistic Greek Aitolians, with massed Ps. For that army, I considered terrain to be my fifth command, as I could get a lot of it and in open competitions few opponents designed armies to deal with such an unusual army. By contrast I know there are some players who put very little thought into what terrain to use or where to attempt to place it.

It's a little trickier with DBMM as there isn't quite as much terrain available as was the case with DBM, although if you place it carefully you can still give your opponent a major headache.

In my experience the best use of terrain starts with careful design of the army. As Lawrence pointed out, Ax will only move slowly through Difficult Going. Ps, by contrast, can move through it using group moves, so they can take the initiative there. You may, for example, wish to consider replacing the Ax (O) with Ps (S), and leading with them through difficult terrain, while the Ax (S) follow in column. I'm also concerned that Command 3 (a) has a bit of everything, but not much of anything, (b) has impetuous troops that move at two different speeds (the Bd (F) and Wb (O)), and (c) has troops that move at five different speeds. This means either you'll have trouble moving everything, or some troops will be forced to move slower than their maximum, costing you maneuverability. I'd humbly submit that it might be worth swapping the scythed chariots for more Irr Kn (I). Having said that, a regular C-in-C whose sub-generals are irregular can choose to swap PIP dice with the nearest irregular sub if he's within 400 paces. As your C-in-C is likely only to be moving straight forward, he might be able to get away with swapping PIPs with Command 3's general if the C-in-C gets the higher PIP dice.

Anyway, moving on to terrain, your army is Aggression 3, so on average you're more likely to be the invader than the defender. So it's probably best to concentrate on invader terrain options. To me, this army appears fairly unmaneuverable; your big danger is your opponent getting troops around your flank. Therefore, you may want to consider placing terrain which will cover a flank, such as a river or a large piece of difficult going. The latter has the advantage of being terrain your Ps and Ax can play in.

I think this may also apply if you're defending. However, with the extra terrain available for defenders, you can take extra smaller pieces with the idea of covering your own flanks, so as to discourage your opponent from trying to flank march.

The other thing to consider is that your Pk are vulnerable even to rough going. There's not much you can do about this - unfortunately you can't rely on opponents being honourable enough to give you good going where you want it. However, one little thing you can do is to nominate your own table edge for your terrain dice. Thus, if your opponent is tempted to place terrain designed to annoy your phalanx, you've maximised your chance that it will fall harmlessly near your own table edge.

Anyway, good luck, and let us know how the games went.